I need to read more testimonies from people who have left a cult. I appreciated Kinzinger’s guest from Leaving MAGA a week or two ago. The anger and isolation peddled by those who wish to divide and instill fear in our communities serves as a warning for all of us. To win we must unite, be brave, and above all love. Opening up hearts will open up minds.
I grew up in a cult, the Jehovah’s Witnesses. They look like nice people, because they generally are. They’re clean cut, hardworking, and faithfully go door to door warning their neighbors that Armageddon is coming and soon. Moreover, if you don’t join their religion, you are an enemy of God. Or if you do join, but later ask questions about why, say their organization’s leaders cover up sexual abuse, why they say it’s okay to lie to the government, why a dying child cannot receive the gift a life from a blood transfusion, or why every single one of the dates they set for the end of the world turned out to be false, they will turn on you, cut you off from every person you have loved, refuse to speak to you and tell their members that you are an enemy of God.
There was nothing anyone outside the group could have said or done to convince me to leave. I was a third generation, fully committed, well connected, absolutely loyal member until one day I realized that I had been had. I was lucky because my parents and one of my brothers had been coming to many of the same conclusions. So when I left, I didn’t lose my entire family. But most people do. And Mike’s exactly right about how whacky cult leaders get when people start to figure it out.
I have a lot of empathy for you. My church life from middle school to high school wasn't fully a cult, but it was very cult-ish. When I left it, I did lose all my friends and most of my family, plus they all said I was possessed by demons. I had doubts all through my adolescence and kept noticing the increasing amounts of hypocrisy within the church, especially the leadership. Something that helped me was having friends outside the church (which was partly why I was in trouble) who were compassionate and accepting, even when they challenged my views. I never changed one belief by being yelled at....but most of them changed from sustained friendship with people who didn't agree with me.
I just listened to an interview between Dan Harris (from the 10% Happier podcast) with Father Gregory Boyle of Homeboy Industries talking about this very topic. It was so profound. One thing that stuck with me is that he said something like, "We have to create communities where nobody is outside the circle of compassion." Even people we think don't deserve it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62tJNPEbOHE
“…no one outside the circle of compassion”. I think I will borrow that.
I fully expect this to become a very large part of American Reconciliation in a post-Trump era. I do NOT feel compelled to be compassionate with those who behave hatefully until that behavior ends and the individuals embrace accountability for such behavior. When someone refuses to debate in good faith….i cannot remain silent nor calm. But I can disengage rather than escalate in a hopeless situation. And, I can also reach out….model behavior that will hopefully cause MAGAs to challenge their belief that I am a communist, socialist, evil or stupid. I can support my neighbors when support is needed….regardless of their politics….and hold hope that those whose politics are vastly dissimilar to mine….might become willing to build consensus on what values that still remain that we share.
Compassion doesn't mean agreement. You can disagree without demonizing someone, as you stated. In my life, I have learned that it's often very difficult to build relationships with people you don't understand. Often, it's our assumptions that we DO understand them from our own perception that helps creates barriers to connection.
I can best explain it through a non-political lens. I have a kid with autism. For a long time, we didn't know he had autism. So we would go into a museum or some busy place and he might suddenly feel overwhelmed and get very upset and try to escape. At first, I reacted to his behavior, not the causes of his behavior, because from my perception, the situation wasn't overwhelming or scary. It was only when I stopped guiding my efforts from my own judgments about what he should be thinking or feeling that I could understand how to help him. I really think this way about the people who disagree with me. The first reaction isn't debate...it's to say in curious non-judgment: "Can you tell me more about why you feel that way?"
I'm not sure I am talking about debating people who are MAGA so much as I am talking about building connections within our communities. And on that subject, Father Boyle said that people who are acting in hatred and violence are unwell. They are not healthy. They are lacking connection. Nobody who is well is attracted to rhetoric like that. But if individuals in our communities are unwell, it also means that our communities themselves are unwell. Our country is unwell. We cannot get past the Trump era by pulling up our drawbridges. We've been doing that and it's only made it worse, in my opinion.
I am no saint. I am angry about a lot of things. I am worried for my autistic son. But I feel to protect him, I have to actually engage with the people in my life who are defending what RFK Jr is doing and the threats I see to my son's future because of them without lecturing them. They care what I think because we have genuine connections. It's hard to do, believe me...and I fail at it all the time, but I really think it's the only way forward.
In regards to my son, I had to set aside my own perceptions to say, "What's really happening for him in this moment? Are the lights overwhelming? Is he afraid?" and then once I did that, I could figure out what helped him cope with situations like that, that's what I mean about curious non-judgment.
I think we are very much on the same page. More interestingly….you used language that I thought I invented (I am a psychotherapist) when I began encouraging people to engage, particularly when in conflict, with an attitude of “nonjudgmental curiosity”. This probably evolved out of conversations on racism when I worked at an agency a few years ago and clinicians were discussing how to handle clients who say overtly racist or vile things….our answer: to ask “What happened that makes you think that way?”
That said. I am also retired military…I was enlisted and served as a firefighter for 21 years. And when someone comes at you with vitriol and hate, there is a brief moment during which you can be nonjudgmental but if they cannot dial down their “shittiness”, I will not be inclined, or perhaps capable of compassion. We must accept that the way to overcome MAGA will require what in the military might be considered “diversity of tactics”. This can include legal action in the courts, peaceful protest, general strikes and ultimately, but hopefully not, armed conflict as a last resort. Through ALL of that….we MUST retain our humanity and allow room for people to change…otherwise will will either succumb to MAGA or become them.
Great post, thank you Mike. Crossing my fingers that we get through this dark period without violence. It is amazing how we all now have devices that can provide us with the world's knowledge in our pockets, but many of us believe utter nonsense.
Omg, Mike! I just finished Amanda Montell's book, Cultish, about how cult leaders (and MLMs, social media influencers, corporations, etc to different extents) use cultish language to control reality and coerce their followers. There are very specific tactics that cult leaders use to do this and to create us vs them mentalities in their followers, to bind them to the cult....and they use language to do it gradually...which is why Trump started with little stupid lies before he got to the big ones. Extremely worrying that in the digital age, the algorithms we have no insight into that operate for their creators' financial benefit are currently doing so much work to control our perceptions and emotions.
This was an excellent article. We have crossed so many lines and become so polarized there may be no way back without winning the trifecta in 2028, but even then. I'm hoping your usually glass half full perspective will prevail. However, Paul Rosenzweig has an excellent piece in The Atlantic today, What a Democrat Could Do With Trump’s Power, America is entering an age of retributive governing cycles. discussing the true tragedy that has befallen our country, even if the Dems get back in office.
Really excellent explanation of the psychology behind conspiracy theories and cults. Thank you for making it so clear.
One of the world’s leading experts on cults, Dr. Stephen Hassan, has said that MAGA is absolutely a cult and Trump is the cult leader. With the many millions of members in the MAGA cult, I think it must be the biggest cult in the world.
We would do well to heed the advice of experts on cults. There is no doubt now that that is the glue holding the MAGA base together. Others are simply immorally complicit. Sadly, when most cults implode it leads to violence.
Jim Jones’ cult collapsed after he convinced hundreds of his cultists to drink poisoned Kool-Ade in Jonestown in the late 1970s. Diaper Don’s cultists probably wouldn’t do this exact thing, but they’d do damn near anything else which Diaper Man asked them.
The actual story is more complicated than that. The cult was collapsing and not everyone wanted to drink the poison...some realized (too late) what Jones was trying to manipulate them into doing and spoke against him. But at that point, they were forced at gunpoint to do it. It's so sad.
The question isn’t “how can you spot a cult?” That’s easy. The question is, “if you were in a cult, how would you know?” Would facts and evidence be enough to convince you that you are trapped?
Unfortunately, the story of Russian collusion was entirely made up. That’s not a political statement. Read. The. Documents. We can’t claim the high ground when we tolerate this behavior out of senior officials.
No, you don't know that you are in a cult while you're in it because the nature of cults is to cut you off completely from connection with people outside the cult. You are taught to view anyone who challenges the leader as dangerous or even demonic. The fear and suspicion of the outside world tightly binds you to the structure of the cult. Facts and logic NEVER work to pull someone away from a cult. Maintaining a genuine connection with people who aren't in it, that's the only way people leave. Cults are always corrupt, always hypocritical. So the individual has to slowly allow themselves to realize the truth about the cult leader. And often, the thing that makes them stay is the fact that the longer they are in the cult, the more they have given up to be in it, and the higher the cost there is for them to leave it. You only survive leaving the cult by finding genuine connections on the outside of it.
I need to read more testimonies from people who have left a cult. I appreciated Kinzinger’s guest from Leaving MAGA a week or two ago. The anger and isolation peddled by those who wish to divide and instill fear in our communities serves as a warning for all of us. To win we must unite, be brave, and above all love. Opening up hearts will open up minds.
I grew up in a cult, the Jehovah’s Witnesses. They look like nice people, because they generally are. They’re clean cut, hardworking, and faithfully go door to door warning their neighbors that Armageddon is coming and soon. Moreover, if you don’t join their religion, you are an enemy of God. Or if you do join, but later ask questions about why, say their organization’s leaders cover up sexual abuse, why they say it’s okay to lie to the government, why a dying child cannot receive the gift a life from a blood transfusion, or why every single one of the dates they set for the end of the world turned out to be false, they will turn on you, cut you off from every person you have loved, refuse to speak to you and tell their members that you are an enemy of God.
There was nothing anyone outside the group could have said or done to convince me to leave. I was a third generation, fully committed, well connected, absolutely loyal member until one day I realized that I had been had. I was lucky because my parents and one of my brothers had been coming to many of the same conclusions. So when I left, I didn’t lose my entire family. But most people do. And Mike’s exactly right about how whacky cult leaders get when people start to figure it out.
I have a lot of empathy for you. My church life from middle school to high school wasn't fully a cult, but it was very cult-ish. When I left it, I did lose all my friends and most of my family, plus they all said I was possessed by demons. I had doubts all through my adolescence and kept noticing the increasing amounts of hypocrisy within the church, especially the leadership. Something that helped me was having friends outside the church (which was partly why I was in trouble) who were compassionate and accepting, even when they challenged my views. I never changed one belief by being yelled at....but most of them changed from sustained friendship with people who didn't agree with me.
I just listened to an interview between Dan Harris (from the 10% Happier podcast) with Father Gregory Boyle of Homeboy Industries talking about this very topic. It was so profound. One thing that stuck with me is that he said something like, "We have to create communities where nobody is outside the circle of compassion." Even people we think don't deserve it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62tJNPEbOHE
“…no one outside the circle of compassion”. I think I will borrow that.
I fully expect this to become a very large part of American Reconciliation in a post-Trump era. I do NOT feel compelled to be compassionate with those who behave hatefully until that behavior ends and the individuals embrace accountability for such behavior. When someone refuses to debate in good faith….i cannot remain silent nor calm. But I can disengage rather than escalate in a hopeless situation. And, I can also reach out….model behavior that will hopefully cause MAGAs to challenge their belief that I am a communist, socialist, evil or stupid. I can support my neighbors when support is needed….regardless of their politics….and hold hope that those whose politics are vastly dissimilar to mine….might become willing to build consensus on what values that still remain that we share.
Compassion doesn't mean agreement. You can disagree without demonizing someone, as you stated. In my life, I have learned that it's often very difficult to build relationships with people you don't understand. Often, it's our assumptions that we DO understand them from our own perception that helps creates barriers to connection.
I can best explain it through a non-political lens. I have a kid with autism. For a long time, we didn't know he had autism. So we would go into a museum or some busy place and he might suddenly feel overwhelmed and get very upset and try to escape. At first, I reacted to his behavior, not the causes of his behavior, because from my perception, the situation wasn't overwhelming or scary. It was only when I stopped guiding my efforts from my own judgments about what he should be thinking or feeling that I could understand how to help him. I really think this way about the people who disagree with me. The first reaction isn't debate...it's to say in curious non-judgment: "Can you tell me more about why you feel that way?"
I'm not sure I am talking about debating people who are MAGA so much as I am talking about building connections within our communities. And on that subject, Father Boyle said that people who are acting in hatred and violence are unwell. They are not healthy. They are lacking connection. Nobody who is well is attracted to rhetoric like that. But if individuals in our communities are unwell, it also means that our communities themselves are unwell. Our country is unwell. We cannot get past the Trump era by pulling up our drawbridges. We've been doing that and it's only made it worse, in my opinion.
I am no saint. I am angry about a lot of things. I am worried for my autistic son. But I feel to protect him, I have to actually engage with the people in my life who are defending what RFK Jr is doing and the threats I see to my son's future because of them without lecturing them. They care what I think because we have genuine connections. It's hard to do, believe me...and I fail at it all the time, but I really think it's the only way forward.
In regards to my son, I had to set aside my own perceptions to say, "What's really happening for him in this moment? Are the lights overwhelming? Is he afraid?" and then once I did that, I could figure out what helped him cope with situations like that, that's what I mean about curious non-judgment.
I think we are very much on the same page. More interestingly….you used language that I thought I invented (I am a psychotherapist) when I began encouraging people to engage, particularly when in conflict, with an attitude of “nonjudgmental curiosity”. This probably evolved out of conversations on racism when I worked at an agency a few years ago and clinicians were discussing how to handle clients who say overtly racist or vile things….our answer: to ask “What happened that makes you think that way?”
That said. I am also retired military…I was enlisted and served as a firefighter for 21 years. And when someone comes at you with vitriol and hate, there is a brief moment during which you can be nonjudgmental but if they cannot dial down their “shittiness”, I will not be inclined, or perhaps capable of compassion. We must accept that the way to overcome MAGA will require what in the military might be considered “diversity of tactics”. This can include legal action in the courts, peaceful protest, general strikes and ultimately, but hopefully not, armed conflict as a last resort. Through ALL of that….we MUST retain our humanity and allow room for people to change…otherwise will will either succumb to MAGA or become them.
Thanks, Alina! I will go listen!
he was talking more about deradicalizing people from hate and violence than about cults specifically. I really appreciated his perspective.
I’ll go check it him out. Thanks!
Great post, thank you Mike. Crossing my fingers that we get through this dark period without violence. It is amazing how we all now have devices that can provide us with the world's knowledge in our pockets, but many of us believe utter nonsense.
Omg, Mike! I just finished Amanda Montell's book, Cultish, about how cult leaders (and MLMs, social media influencers, corporations, etc to different extents) use cultish language to control reality and coerce their followers. There are very specific tactics that cult leaders use to do this and to create us vs them mentalities in their followers, to bind them to the cult....and they use language to do it gradually...which is why Trump started with little stupid lies before he got to the big ones. Extremely worrying that in the digital age, the algorithms we have no insight into that operate for their creators' financial benefit are currently doing so much work to control our perceptions and emotions.
This was an excellent article. We have crossed so many lines and become so polarized there may be no way back without winning the trifecta in 2028, but even then. I'm hoping your usually glass half full perspective will prevail. However, Paul Rosenzweig has an excellent piece in The Atlantic today, What a Democrat Could Do With Trump’s Power, America is entering an age of retributive governing cycles. discussing the true tragedy that has befallen our country, even if the Dems get back in office.
Really excellent explanation of the psychology behind conspiracy theories and cults. Thank you for making it so clear.
One of the world’s leading experts on cults, Dr. Stephen Hassan, has said that MAGA is absolutely a cult and Trump is the cult leader. With the many millions of members in the MAGA cult, I think it must be the biggest cult in the world.
Thanks for the post, Mike. I feel better prepared to weather the storm.
The is really psychopathic behavior! This President is mentally unfit to serve. How can people not see this?
We would do well to heed the advice of experts on cults. There is no doubt now that that is the glue holding the MAGA base together. Others are simply immorally complicit. Sadly, when most cults implode it leads to violence.
Obama's birth certificate is still more popular with the cult than 2020 being stolen?
Jim Jones’ cult collapsed after he convinced hundreds of his cultists to drink poisoned Kool-Ade in Jonestown in the late 1970s. Diaper Don’s cultists probably wouldn’t do this exact thing, but they’d do damn near anything else which Diaper Man asked them.
The actual story is more complicated than that. The cult was collapsing and not everyone wanted to drink the poison...some realized (too late) what Jones was trying to manipulate them into doing and spoke against him. But at that point, they were forced at gunpoint to do it. It's so sad.
You forgot a big one (unless I missed it):
No collusion.
Can’t happen fast enough. I want to see MAGA turn on itself.
I'd gladly chip in for the special MAGA KoolAid drinkathon!
The question isn’t “how can you spot a cult?” That’s easy. The question is, “if you were in a cult, how would you know?” Would facts and evidence be enough to convince you that you are trapped?
Unfortunately, the story of Russian collusion was entirely made up. That’s not a political statement. Read. The. Documents. We can’t claim the high ground when we tolerate this behavior out of senior officials.
No, you don't know that you are in a cult while you're in it because the nature of cults is to cut you off completely from connection with people outside the cult. You are taught to view anyone who challenges the leader as dangerous or even demonic. The fear and suspicion of the outside world tightly binds you to the structure of the cult. Facts and logic NEVER work to pull someone away from a cult. Maintaining a genuine connection with people who aren't in it, that's the only way people leave. Cults are always corrupt, always hypocritical. So the individual has to slowly allow themselves to realize the truth about the cult leader. And often, the thing that makes them stay is the fact that the longer they are in the cult, the more they have given up to be in it, and the higher the cost there is for them to leave it. You only survive leaving the cult by finding genuine connections on the outside of it.
who cares